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Fairion felehta

Fairion felehta

PostAuthor: órerámar » Wed Mar 03, 2010 9:06 pm

I have posted a poem under work on Aglardh. Comments, critic, corrections are most welcome either on Aglardh directly or here.

http://aglardh.middangeard.org.uk/
órerámar
 
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Re: Fairion felehta

PostAuthor: Tuilinde » Thu Jun 10, 2010 5:17 pm

Finally I have made time to read your poem. Please forgive me for not getting to it any sooner.

I have enjoyed it very much, and it's very skilful both in its metre and syllabic count, and also in its rhyme scheme.. I'm definitely wanting to know what happens next!

I have some queries / comments:

Looking carefully at Helge's list, I would probably use yonna rather than yonda for 'enclosed'.

The next line is a complicated mix of singulars and plurals. In colloquial English we would say ' ''White Maidens" was the name for the women' and probably all you need to do in the Quenya is make it "Lossewendi".

Checking in my dictionary, it is very rare to find raiment used in a plural form in English. It is a noun which generally stays in the same form for both singular and plural. And I would be inclined to say their raiment. This is of course no definitive guide as to what the Quenya would do!! Would nassentar lamantar work, or are we then in the realm of the last declineable word?!?!?

Then in the next line I don't understand the mi. Why is it there?

You've used imbe for valley and imbi for among. My poor brain found that confusing. I realise the choice may have been dictated by the rhyme scheme, but could you use a different word for the valley??

In the last section, I believe the English should be Comets like they were rather than alike.

Thank you for sharing it with us.

Finally, is it possible to copy and paste it into this forum?
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Re: Fairion felehta

PostAuthor: órerámar » Fri Jun 11, 2010 10:59 pm

Thank you Tuilinde for your input, I appreciate your comments.

Looking carefully at Helge's list, I would probably use yonna rather than yonda for 'enclosed'.


Helge's list, although very precise, cannot give all the information that is found in PE17. There is a past tense mentioned "yonde" that is marked as archaic/poetic and "yonda" that follows could therefore be a past participle. It is translated as "enclosed". In an other section "yonda" is given as adj. wide, roomy, extensive. Since I have used the construction with "ló" there cannot be a confusion with the adjective.

Looking at my draft, I just realise that I had changed that line already some time ago into : peryana ló síre.. "halved by the river...", after I had visited the grotto and the valley that are the place of the legend and saw that the river is right in the middle and not a boundary.

T
he next line is a complicated mix of singulars and plurals. In colloquial English we would say ' ''White Maidens" was the name for the women' and probably all you need to do in the Quenya is make it "Lossewendi".


You are quite right. Actually there is an idea behind that. I wanted to state the name like a personal name "Lossewen" and put it between quotation marks and later used it as a groupe definition without quotation marks. But that may not be obvious. I shall change that.

Checking in my dictionary, it is very rare to find raiment used in a plural form in English. It is a noun which generally stays in the same form for both singular and plural. And I would be inclined to say their raiment. This is of course no definitive guide as to what the Quenya would do!! Would nassentar lamantar work, or are we then in the realm of the last declineable word?!?!?


No last declineable word here. The Quenya "larmantar" is correct. Tolkien used the plural and in English the singular "raiment". I was not aware that this word is not used in the plural. I shall amend the English translation.

Then in the next line I don't understand the mi. Why is it there?


..and there is a typo, it should read "mi lossea".

...which in white fell to the ground. This is attested in "Sanome tarne Olórin, Arakorno, Eomer, Imrahil, mi mīse, mi telepta yo morna, mi laiqua yo ninque, mi luini, ta Gimli mi losseä". There stood Gandalf and Aragorn and Eomer and Imrahil, in grey, and in silver and black, and in green and white, in blue and Gimli in white. (PE17:71)

You've used imbe for valley and imbi for among. My poor brain found that confusing. I realise the choice may have been dictated by the rhyme scheme, but could you use a different word for the valley??


Although I would love to be helpful to your brain, I shall keep to "imbe", noun =tween-land like Rivendell says PE17:92 possibly from a similar but different stem IBI.
Hey, I think your brain is trained for homonymes, after all you are speaking one of the most difficult languages, according to a well known linguist! :)

In the last section, I believe the English should be Comets like they were rather than alike.


There is not only a problem with the English, but especially with the Quenya and I have not solved it yet. "Vávea and ovéa" = alike, (con)similar are different from the simple "ve" = like and therefore the sentence has probably to be constructed differently. There is no attested example. To be honest, I was fed up toying around with that sentence and posted it to get it out of my mind and on to something else. I shall probably rewrite those two lines.

Thanks again for your helpful remarks.

By the way, I had a look at your Sestina and shall come back to it during this weekend.
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Re: Fairion felehta

PostAuthor: órerámar » Sun Jun 13, 2010 1:48 pm

Finally, is it possible to copy and paste it into this forum?


Sorry, Tuilinde, I shall not copy it here, but I think I owe you an explanation. I consider Aglardh as a sort of home base, because I have spent there a great deal of time and had a lot of fun. I had decided right from the beginning that this was the only place I would post my texts except from my Home page. In the last 3 years, although I was a member of other forums, I have maintained that resolution and I would like to keep it that way. There will be of course exceptions, as there have already been, like showing a drawing on a haiku or some of my English poetry.

Updating my text yesterday made me also suddenly realize that inviting comments to be posted here or on Aglardh does not make sense, because they should be with the text. Duplication will produce confusion - in my opinion, reciprocity would be more beneficial.

Thank you for your understanding.

BTW - one of the updates concerns the use of simple past participles described in PE17, forms like "carinwa, cárienwa".
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Re: Fairion felehta

PostAuthor: Tuilinde » Sun Jun 20, 2010 12:40 pm

Thanks for that explanation, it makes perfect sense, and I'm quite happy with it. I hope that you will continue to tell us when new works are on Aglardh, so that we can go and read them there, and enjoy and learn!
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Re: Fairion felehta

PostAuthor: atwe » Mon Jun 21, 2010 10:24 am

órerámar wrote:
Finally, is it possible to copy and paste it into this forum?


Sorry, Tuilinde, I shall not copy it here, but I think I owe you an explanation. I consider Aglardh as a sort of home base, because I have spent there a great deal of time and had a lot of fun. I had decided right from the beginning that this was the only place I would post my texts except from my Home page. In the last 3 years, although I was a member of other forums, I have maintained that resolution and I would like to keep it that way. There will be of course exceptions, as there have already been, like showing a drawing on a haiku or some of my English poetry.


I am touched!
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Re: Fairion felehta

PostAuthor: órerámar » Thu Jul 22, 2010 8:30 pm

I have updated my poem with a few more lines over on Aglardh.


http://aglardh.middangeard.org.uk/
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Re: Fairion felehta

PostAuthor: Huanarmo » Tue Jul 27, 2010 6:08 am

This is lovely writing. I printed it and was inspired to try reading the Quenya aloud.

It has the wonderful 'flow and ripple' effect that, to my mind, marks fine Quenya writing. May I say Tuilinde's work has this quality too, and an excellent piece I have by Findegil. These works are little treasures; all the hallmarks are there and it's marvellous to be able to turn to such beautiful work, especially when we have only a few gems readily available in published form from Tolkien himself.

Thanks for providing the link. It works very easily to see it that way on the Aglardh site, and having it posted in the one place makes good sense while it is a work in progress.

It pleased me to see the wolves cast as guardians of the White Maidens. They are much maligned beasts, considering they are the ancestors of our own beloved companion hounds. You may have guessed I'm a dog person.

And you can probably tell that I, too, am looking forward to more of this fine tale!

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Re: Fairion felehta

PostAuthor: órerámar » Sat Aug 28, 2010 12:31 pm

"Thanks" to the absolutely horrible weather during my vacation, I managed to write a few more lines - Donat's adventure continues on Aglardh:


http://aglardh.middangeard.org.uk/
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Re: Fairion felehta

PostAuthor: órerámar » Sun Oct 10, 2010 8:44 pm

A new update on Aglardh and hopefully the next one will also be the last one.


http://aglardh.middangeard.org.uk/
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